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User blog:ThisWriter/Bocks or my vision of the Box
I'm writing this blog post because I'm in disagreement with the new vision of the Box that is starting to form. Before the Box was the uncontested accepted top level structure of everything. Now some people are starting to accept the existence of some structures outside of it and I disagree with it. I was asked not to change the page of the Box to change this aspect of it so I'm putting my vision of all this on this blog post. Backstory When I came to this wiki I already had my own cosmology which included my own top level structure: the Omniumverse. Instead of falling back into that game of trying to out-beat everything else with it, after looking at the Box I've realized something, they could be seen as being the same thing, only described from a different point of view. That lead me to writing the Law of Box Equivalency in another blog post. I did this because I realized how useful it was to have a well accepted top level structure as a common ground but also because I didn't want to play the game of trying to out beat each other and see who can come up with something even larger. Apparently that was also part of the reason the Box was created to begin with. So, I'm of the belief that if someone actually manages to find some way to beat the Box, the Box should actually be changed and redefined to, at the minimum, make it equal to such new structure. I know that's what I'm going to do with the Omniumverse. Because their entire point is to be the top level structure, not to present a challenge or target to try to be beaten by other more creative structures. About the Box To me the Box was never truly about size. It was instead about containment. Even if its page defines it as being the largest thing, it never really seemed that important. The important thing was that it contained everything else. If someone wanted to create something larger, fine, it would be inside the Box anyway because size wasn't important at all. The same for any other property. The Box does not need to be the ultimate thing in any property at all. There can be things larger, more abstract, more generic, less defined, more unthinkable, more whatever one wants, when compared to the Box. All those would still be inside it without any problem. The Box does not need to be more abstract than everything inside it or less defined than anything inside it or larger than anything inside it. It just needs to contain everything inside it. There is some idea that structures cannot contain other structures that have some higher properties than the containing structure, like being more abstract or more unthinkable. Even if we would accept this as is, it could never apply to the Box itself because it breaks all those limitations necessarily, if only by containing all paradoxes inside it (in case we consider that situation to be one). Its about Containment Even being about containment, the previous argument still holds. It is possible to have some structure that contains more things than the Box itself. Such structure will still be contained by the Box. It is possible to have some structure that contains the Box. Such structure will still be contained by the Box as well. The Box contains itself so this was already a well accepted possibility anyway. The possibility that other structures also contain the Box and are contained by it are nothing more than a natural extension of that. Paradoxes The paradoxes of having something that contains the Box also be contained by it or having something larger than the Box exist inside it are nothing new or problematic at all. The Box was already defined as containing all paradoxical things, all paradoxes even. The Box is also stated as containing all impossible things. Accepting the description of the Box as is, which states that everything exists inside it, we cay say that anything that is defined to be outside of it is impossible. This leads us to the conclusion that all the things that exist outside of the Box are impossible, therefore they are also inside it. For that matter, the actual exterior of the Box (which does not exist at all), exists inside the Box. New structures People are now trying to surpass this by defining things that transcend containment itself, are beyond even the concept of containment, cannot be contained by anything at all, etc. These are all nice new structures with interesting possibilities. But as you can guess by now, in my opinion yes, they are all inside the Box anyway. There are several reasons for this: The fact that trying to create something larger or over the Box goes against its main purpose for existing in the first place; The fact that the paradoxes created by those definitions are not problematic at all; And the fact that, even by the written definition of the Box as is, even those structures would already be inside of it anyway. They would already be inside the Box anyway These new structures are trying to beat the Box through more abstract and generalized concepts and by trying to be above some other concepts. Problem is: all that requires them to be imagined and thought that way. People need to thing about them in order to construct them in such ways. Well, the page of the Box states that: "The Box contains anything beyond space, time, reality, logic, and everything else that could ever be thought of or not thought of." Everything thought of or not thought of. Those structures have obviously been thought of so they don't even get closer to the more exotic things that exist inside the Box because they have never been, or actually cannot be, thought of, unlike the ones being currently placed outside of it. "The Box not only contains all of existence, but infinite variations of an infinite set of 'concepts' completely different from existence. The box contains everything outside the box, whilst still being contained by The Box." Even if we accepted those structures as being "outside the box", by its own definition, they would still be contained by it. "Additionally, the Box contains all properties and anything that can be elaborated or not elaborated upon;" These new structures have been elaborated and have their own properties, no matter how creative, so by definition they are inside the Box. "effectively, all statements include the tag "is inside the Box" by definition." This puts it nicely. It refers to everything without exception. I don't understand how there is even a discussion about this! Unless the Box page is changed to allow some loop holes in it, which it currently does not, there is already no way of creating anything outside of it that is also not inside it. In conclusion So my definite position on this is that everything, including these new structures are indeed inside the Box. My position is also that, when the creator of the Box thinks otherwise he is actually in contradiction with the Box as currently described. I believe that my view of the Box best corresponds to the actual description presented on its page and I believe that for the Box to correspond to the new view being presented by those who accept the new structures as being outside of it or surpassing it in any way its text would need to be modified to make it something less than what it currently is and always have been up until now. I dunnot think that that change should be made because it would destroy the Box as it currently stands. It is an important symbol that, in my opinion, should be kept on its place. The Omniumverse Although I continue to present the Omniumverse as being the same as the Box (as defined by my view), if this new view of the Box (yes this is a new view of it) prevails my position will be that the Omniumverse is actually above the Box, as well as of all these new structures that are being put over it as well. In that case the Law of Box Equivalency will no longer apply to the Box itself, it will apply to the Omniumverse and to what I will be calling the Bocks to refer to my view of the Box as presented on this blog post. Other Box level structures I would actually really like to see new structures equivalent to the Box being created and described. We need more creative and varied structures, just as long as they are not just the same thing with a slightly different form or name like having a round or a triangular Box. But creative new points of view, new ways to describe what would be a top level structure would be very interesting in my opinion. But this is a very different thing than continuing to try to up-beat it one more time. Category:Blog posts